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  • #35607
    Profile photo of carpedebass
    carpedebass
    Survivalist
    member3

    OK, I think it is a good thing to run different scenarios through mentally beforehand to have a prepared mind. Trying to figure out what you would/will do in certain instances will help you to mentally be ready when the time comes. It trains your mind to think in those terms and I’m a big believer in it. In no way do I think we can be mentally prepared for everything that may present itself, but training our minds can’t hurt.

    That said, I have a scenario that keeps me awake at night. I have a location out in the sticks complete with ponds, gardens, livestock, four water wells and a nice elevated view in almost all directions. The great thing is, you cannot see the house or any of the goodies until you’re right on top of it from most directions, but the house can be seen from one direction. The house looks run down and abandoned from a distance, but is actually alive and well.

    One of my primary abilities/advantages is stand off. The ability to engage threats at distance rather than waiting until they are on top of me. I am trained and continue training in long range marksmanship. As are other members of my group. That doesn’t mean that everyone that shows up is going to be shot. At some point we have to start thinking in terms of community and rebuilding it. Shooting people on sight is NOT the way to do that. I’m talking in terms of bartering or combining forces and resources. I am trying to work out a communication system that will allow us to speak to people at distance to determine their need for being there. I also have the ability to watch the surrounding area to ensure we’re not being set up or ambushed.

    The term “threat” is ambiguous and should not ONLY be considered as some guys in body armor sneaking along with AKs. It can also be an added individual who is going to consume precious resources or introduce some contagion.

    Here is the scenario that keeps me awake at night…
    While watching the surrounding area, you see some “mother of the year” point toward your location and tell her 3 year old child, “Go to that house. They’ll feed you.” Then the “mom” turns around and leaves, never to return. Some research reveals this very thing happened a lot during the great depression. You are now provided with a decision. What do you do? The child is not an immediate threat, but will consume precious resources. The child may have a communicable disease. Or it may be completely healthy. At this point, you have no clue.

    As I see it, there are three options. Shoot the child, leave the child where it is and hope it wanders off, or bring the child in.

    I honestly believe there is a certain element of this crowd that may be callous enough that putting this child out of it’s misery is a viable option. But honestly, I don’t think I could do it. If the child were wearing explosives and a timer, that’s another issue. I also don’t think I could be heartless enough to leave it there. Am I alone in thinking through these scenarios, or does anyone else here do this? So, let’s hear from you, SHTF community…what would you do and why? Please don’t throw out some juvenile tough guy/gal answer unless you really honestly think it through and can live with yourself and your decision afterward. I’d say “Me and Mine” mentality will only work for so long.

    #35609
    Profile photo of MountainBiker
    MountainBiker
    Survivalist
    member10

    carpedebass, I recently read that parents are abandoning children in Greece currently when they reach the point that they just cannot feed or care for them anymore. One story I read was about this happening at day care centers. The child gets dropped off with a note that says the parent won’t be picking them up again.

    Were the scenario you describe happen to me, I would take the child in and do my best to see that he/she survives. I have had (and continue to have) a good life, and I am curious enough to want to see how things turn out, but my real goal is not my personal survival but rather that of my kids and grandkids. The future lies with my grand babies, not me. In a sudden SHTF scenario, my daughter & her family will be trapped in a suburban setting 850 miles from here. They would not be able to make it to my place. Should that come to pass, the hope I would be clinging to is that someone like myself would do what they could to save my grand daughters (who will turn 3 and 1 this spring). That may just be wishful thinking on my part but how could I expect someone to help my grand daughters if I’m not willing to help someone else’s? And so yes I would take the child in.

    #35610
    Profile photo of carpedebass
    carpedebass
    Survivalist
    member3

    Well said Mountain Biker. I, like you, have grandchildren. Hopefully mine will be with me at the time. I think like you though. I really don’t think I could live with myself if I did not take the child in. I would likely quarantine the child for a time to minimize the exposure.

    #35611
    Profile photo of Brulen
    Brulen
    Survivalist
    member9

    Thats what we have orphanages for…. That being said we have Baby Boomers refusing to take care of their elderly parents. They take all the belongings and then take them to the door of the nursing home and leave them.
    You’re out in the woods one day and a very old toothless dog starts to follow you home. Its been abandoned to scrounge for food and eventually starve to death. What do you do?

    #35612
    Profile photo of Roadracer
    Roadracer
    Survivalist
    member7

    With 11 grandchildren, some of them thousands of miles away, I share your concern. My wife and I have discussed this very real possibility, and have come to the conclusion that we would care for the child. We have been blessed in our lives, and could not turn a child away. Will our resources drain faster absolutely, but we will keep our humanity to the end. I hope and pray if any of our grandkids find themselves in a similar situation that someone would care for them.

    I can’t imagine the pain of having to give up your child because you can’t take care of him or her. I know there are some heartless and cruel adults out there, but I suspect like many of the people in Greece, they don’t want to watch their child suffer.

    #35613
    Profile photo of carpedebass
    carpedebass
    Survivalist
    member3

    Brulen, at first I responded harshly to you but had to edit. I did ask the question. I have had loved ones in nursing homes and have seen people there as you describe. I think it’s honestly horrid behavior to do that to someone. Your response is duly noted. However, in a collapse situation, do you really think there will be orphanages?

    #35617
    Profile photo of carpedebass
    carpedebass
    Survivalist
    member3

    Roadracer, I cannot imagine it either. But I’m glad to hear that you are mentally preparing as well as (hopefully) physically preparing.

    #35621
    Profile photo of sledjockey
    sledjockey
    Bushcrafter
    member8

    The other aspect of this is the definite possibility of the child having been prepped to mitigate any security that has been put in place such as unlocking doors in the night, use of flashlights during light discipline designated times, noise, etc. This was common for Vietnam soldiers/sympathizers to do. They would drop off orphans to US military bases with just enough instruction to turn on lights, yell/scream at night, etc. It cost many soldiers their lives.

    If this is something that you plan on doing (taking in youngsters) then you better prepare before hand to take care of them. They better be all but quarantined and watched 24/7 until they get totally integrated into your family.

    http://ageofdecadence.com

    #35623
    Profile photo of carpedebass
    carpedebass
    Survivalist
    member3

    Great point Sledjockey. But, what would you do?

    #35625
    Profile photo of 74
    74
    Survivalist
    rnews

    carpedebass,
    This is truly one of the more difficult issues that could present themselves. I hadn’t been thinking about an abandoned child. You could have youth show up by themselves. An aspect that must be considered is how many would you shelter if you bring them in. Are you ready to be “the orphanage”.

    Someone providing food and shelter will soon be overrun with new arrivals. Word of your benevolence and larder will spread. Consideration to your location is important. In a rural setting you may only have a few wayward souls to deal with. A location closer to an urban area may have many many people looking for food.

    My initial response would be to have a perimeter large enough to prevent this scenario and turn people away. I anticipate a large volume of refugees initially. Later it might be different conditions with different objectives.

    #35626
    Profile photo of carpedebass
    carpedebass
    Survivalist
    member3

    74, I completely agree with your stance too. Your viewpoint and considerations are exactly why I am conflicted by this scenario. The resultant influx of kids would be very likely. That in itself is a serious threat. You have put thought into this scenario. I appreciate that!!

    We do have a large perimeter, but it is only fenced off with 4 foot barbed wire and easy to cross or go under. The area is much too large to watch the entire thing. The possibility of a mother dropping her kid off with instructions to go up the road to the house is easily foreseeable. Now…what if you tell the child to go away and it keeps coming toward your house? What then? This is where my nightmare begins. I agree with both sides here. Thus my conflict.

    #35627
    Profile photo of MountainBiker
    MountainBiker
    Survivalist
    member10

    74 and sledjockey both make good points, and I will admit I hadn’t thought about the point sledjockey made about the kids being plants to jeopardize security. Older kids maybe, but not toddlers such as the 3 year old used in the example. Still, though I can’t save everyone, I will save a few if I can. As Roadracer said, I want to maintain my humanity right up to the end.

    #35628
    Profile photo of 74
    74
    Survivalist
    rnews

    This is not simple because of the multiple types of shtf we could endure. Additionally if you don’t have the food resources for yourself and family for whatever reason, it will itensify the problem. Under certain circumstances I could have an seemingly endless supply of corn, but I might have none at all as well. I don’t want to be a welfare station, nor be robbed and or killed.

    #35631
    Tolik
    Tolik
    Survivalist
    member10

    Be honest with you , I would take it in , There is a special place in hell reserved for those that knowingly and willingly , harm or kill a child . You will have a choice of cell mates , Hitler , Stalin , or Mau . I think I would pick Stalin , as Hitlers tantrums would get on my nerves too much . It would be a simple matter to keep the child in a barn for observation , then when you feel he/she doesnt have a disease , take it to the house …..it is what it is . Remember also , you will get to a point in your life , where you are no longer able to take care of yourself , or do even the smallest tasks , and be completely dependent on the good graces of others , some of which you will not know . Its called old age . Just Sayin

    #35634
    Profile photo of 74
    74
    Survivalist
    rnews

    And what do you do if this child is an infiltrater?

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