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  • #17329
    chester
    chester
    Survivalist
    member7

    A social factor in SHTF are those that feel in the ‘have-not’ class coming for those in the ‘haves’ class. I can see this having a sliding scale where you don’t necessarily need to be a billionaire to be a target. I know my family could definitely be a target. We play it very low profile and not flaunt our wealth (car, dress, home, preps etc.).

    ‘To My Fellow Filthy Rich Americans: Wake Up, People. The Pitchforks Are Coming’

    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-06-27/my-fellow-filthy-rich-americans-wake-people-pitchforks-are-coming

    #17343
    Profile photo of freedom
    freedom
    Survivalist
    rnews

    Well chester, this is something the 1% will have to look out for. Nothing new here, this has happened in other countries.

    The problem all started when everything is made outside of the U. S. This is a problem. We need to put high taxes on imports that are from China and other countries that are under the cost of a product can be made in the U. S.

    If taxing products from other counties doesn’t work then tax all profits made outside of the U. S. by U. S. companies.

    I know this doesn’t sound good but when all products were made in the U. S. there was work for everyone and a large middle class.

    To all the U. S. Corp lower there taxes to the lowest rate worldwide so they make more products here. It is all about business. Make it were businesses come to the U. S. because it is cheaper to make it here.

    #17351
    Profile photo of patjoe
    patjoe
    Survivalist
    member2

    I hoped high tarriffs would bring back manufacturing jobs to Canada, until I watched Sam Vallely’s film “Will Work for Free”. His thesis is that most jobs will be automated by 2025, causing widespread unemployment. Robots will replace many human workers and 3-D printers will replace factories, pharmacies, and retail stores. He gives the current examples of robots replacing warehouse workers at Amazon, and cashiers at McDonalds Germany, and taxi drivers at Google Cars, and migrant farm workers at hydroponics operations in many countries. I reluctantly admit Vallely is probably on the right track because three of my own jobs have been made obsolete in 30 years and I had to retrain each time I was made redundant. There will be hunger and social strife as we transition from capitalism into a resource-based economy. That’s why I think it’s wise to prep and learn to grow a small family food forest, like they do in suburban Vietnam and North Africa. If you’re interested in the two-hour film, it’s free at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0SuGRgdJA_c.

    #17355
    Profile photo of MountainBiker
    MountainBiker
    Survivalist
    member10

    Whereas the Zerohedge article talked about the 1%, the issue really extends much further down the economic ladder to just the middling rich or even upper middle class, especially in urban & suburban areas where those with money segregate themselves from the working class and poor. I can see those anonymous folks in their McMansions being “them” vs “us” to the disaffected masses. In more rural and small towns, the affluent usually aren’t anonymous, and to the extent that they are regular folks and not complete snobs and a$$holes, they likely won’t suffer the fate of the anonymous “them” in urban/suburban areas.

    By way of example, while I don’t consider myself rich I know that I have far more than most people do. When we bought our BOL we paid twice what the average home around here costs for a place in great need of repair and renovation, and immediately began some very visible and major renovations. That in combination with our being from MA and it being a second home and I might as well have worn a label on my forehead saying “rich out-of-stater”. It then came as a surprise to the locals when they saw me personally endlessly working on the house and property doing as much as I could. “Rich out-of-staters” don’t do that kind of work, nor do they help neighbors with the haying, come over with a chainsaw to cut limbs, or a log splitter to help split wood, Or sit around a campfire drinking beer with them, or talking about veggie gardens and canning with them. Yes my place is bigger and nicer than most and they know that I’m not poor but I’m not anonymous and have been accepted as a member of the community. I don’t expect there will be pitchforks coming in my direction.

    #17356
    Profile photo of freedom
    freedom
    Survivalist
    rnews

    patjoe, If by 2025 everything is made by robots then China is over! Also they said that when the computer was invented that would be the end of paper, lol we use more paper now then before. So I don’t think so.

    Remember if they get rid of all jobs then there is no buyers for the products that they product so the elite would have to close shop. There is a balance, jobs = money = products sold without one there is none.

    So you can’t have rich people running robots and no jobs because no jobs means no sales of products.

    #17366
    Malgus
    Malgus
    Survivalist
    member8

    freedom,

    Can’t raise tariffs on Chinese made garbage without rescinding their Most Favored Nation status. We do that, the Chinese just might decide to play power politics.. They hold a great deal of our debt. If raising import tariffs and removing their MFN status will kill their economy, they will probably dump a good chunk of our debt, which will in turn kill our economy…

    Thanks to Clintoon for giving the little commie bastards MFN status in the first place… wonder how much payola he got in return for that?

    The wicked flee when none pursueth..." - Proverbs 28:1

    #17374
    Tolik
    Tolik
    Survivalist
    member10

    I say let it happen , thing is , the world economy and especially ours , is being held together by a thread , everybody is trying to fix the blown artery with a band aid . At some point , the artery is going to burst ………no stopping it , no band aid is going to fix it . Quite frankly , it needs to happen sooner rather than later . And with that economic disaster , we will see several governments around the world changing hands , again , that may not be a bad thing , and in some cases long overdue .

    #17376
    Profile photo of freedom
    freedom
    Survivalist
    rnews

    On this one I I have to agree with Tolik to let it happen. It is going to happen anyway. It is the only way to bring back jobs to the U. S. It is time that everything we but says Made in the U. S. A.

    The Chinese would do it to us!

    #17378
    Profile photo of patjoe
    patjoe
    Survivalist
    member2

    Is a slow economic decline preferable to an abrupt crash? Do you think urban homesteading and co-ops will make our descent any easier? Permaculture prophet David Holmgren wrote a very controversial paper about an inevitable economic collapse called “Crash on Demand” and was rebutted by Rob Hopkins of the Transition movement:

    http://holmgren.com.au/crashdemand-interviews/

    https://www.transitionnetwork.org/blogs/rob-hopkins/2014-01/holmgren-s-crash-demand-be-careful-what-you-wish

    #17384
    Profile photo of Roadracer
    Roadracer
    Survivalist
    member7

    I agree it’s going to happen. Not sure if fast or slow, but I am leaning to slow. Politicians will continue to lie and manipulate data up to the very end. I hesitate to discuss tariffs. Most trade wars become shooting wars. I do not have confidence that the President will hold back on pushing the button, especially if he’s cornered. There have been three modern Presidents that I feared would not leave office no matter if there was an election or not. They are, Richard Nixon, Bill Clinton and the present occupant of the White House.

    Mountain Biker: Way to set a great example. If all preppers acted like you do I’m sure the general population would be more welcoming to our message. Helping your neighbors is never a bad investment. Even if one turns out to be jerk, most others will recognize the good intentions. And if the SHTF in a serious way, many may look to you for leadership. Then you can help direct the pitchforks.

    #17398
    Profile photo of MountainBiker
    MountainBiker
    Survivalist
    member10

    Thanks Roadracer, I know that some are capable of going it alone come TEOTWAWKI but most of us can’t, me included. It is why I bought a place in a sort of hamlet rather than in an isolated location. It is also why I have worked to establish myself as someone who can be part of the solution with something to contribute. The farmers in the neighborhood are experts in ways I will never be but me having a large veggie garden and fruit trees adds to the potential food production in the neighborhood. My knowing how to can and being very well supplied in terms of canning jars, extra lids etc will make me useful, as will my apple press. My having stockpiled seeds & related supplies can get gardens started all over the neighborhood. Of course the neighbors don’t know that I’m a prepper with a rather full basement but they can see the greenhouse we built and likely have noticed the hand pump we added to our well. I make really good bread in dutch ovens and though I only make bread sporadically when the mood moves me I have given dozens of loaves away as little gifts to neighbors and folks I meet. They like it when I say I’ll bring bread to cookouts. I’ve given away fresh stuff from my garden and also things I’ve canned, and received similar from others in the neighborhood. I’m not a hunter and likely won’t be at this stage of the game but many of the guys around here do hunt, and so I’ve said feel free to hunt in my woods. The ones that grew up here know my land better than I do. I’m not a fisherman either and don’t really plan to take it up, but I’ve told a few to feel free to fish in my pond. I’m convinced that anyone can make themselves useful if they choose to do so, but the time to establish one’s usefulness is before the storm hits.

    #17402
    chester
    chester
    Survivalist
    member7

    +1 on that MountainBiker … it’s our approach as well. Fostering a culture with resilience in mind.

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