Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 17 total)
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  • #22793
    Profile photo of Ogre206
    Ogre206
    Survivalist
    member2

    so this is my first post, so first let me say hello.
    Yall can just call me Ogre because I like Ogres (not shriek) I am 18 and started prepping since I was 15, I move most of the things I think are necessary (for at least two weeks). “survival” food with a impressive self-life, sealed water, first-aid kits, two bows and plenty of broad-head arrows, blankets,tarps,tents and sleeping bags.The thing I am missing ,however, is a firearm (that I can immediately get) and I’m looking to buy one of my own, So please tell me First, am I missing something (apart from a back up generator) Second do yall think an SKS-D will be a good investment for me?
    ( I know that Sensei Selco places a great deal on blending in and let me tell you, the four guns most civilians have here are the hunting-gun the sagia rifle the AR-15 and the SKS.) the rifle is a semi-large priority, my pop lives about 7-mins by car 30-mins by bike and has “my” lever action there but I dont want to waste time to get it when the stuff goes down because I have a big family that will rely on me for protection (no they aren’t zombies, we all have our roles and that one is mine)

    #22796
    Malgus
    Malgus
    Survivalist
    member8

    Welcome Ogre,

    Glad to have you.

    Everyone is going to tell you something different re: what firearm you should purchase. I’m not going to do that. I can’t tell you what you want, nor what would be best given your circumstances.

    First question would be: What are you going to be doing with it?
    Second would be: What is your level of experience with firearms?
    Third would be: What is the country like where you live?

    Thing is, it has to be robust. It has to be accurate. It has to be simple. It has to be easy to feed.

    Guns that are fragile are useless. Guns that are inaccurate are worse than useless. Complicated guns require extensive practice. Guns that require rarefied ammo can be hard or expensive to feed…

    We can bat this around all day, but it boils down to there is no one, single weapon that can do it all. Weapons are a tool box. You pick the appropriate one for the job. So long as it does it’s job, you can hit with it and have enough ammo for it, which one you use is pretty much up to you…

    Message me if you want to bat this around…

    And again, welcome…

    The wicked flee when none pursueth..." - Proverbs 28:1

    #22800
    Profile photo of Ogre206
    Ogre206
    Survivalist
    member2

    thank you for the advice Malgus.
    It seems like you and I both speak the same language on terms of firearms so ill skip right to those three questions.
    number one: Mostly hunting and unfortunately ’round here there are alot of two-bit punks who want nothing more than to get into a gunfight, so if need be I will defend my loved ones (as a last resort, I’m a fairly good shot but I’m no commando)
    number two: I have been shooting guns my whole life and I’m no stranger to stripping and cleaning.
    number three: I live in a town next to a med-sized city so far as non-urban environments go whatever isnt a arid shurb-land is a mountain pine forest (they are some what thick) that gets alot of rain in the spring and alot of snow in the winter.

    #22811
    Profile photo of MountainBiker
    MountainBiker
    Survivalist
    member10

    Welcome Ogre! Malgus is right, there is no one best rifle. The very first gun I bought, a S&W 1911 is now my least favorite of the guns I own. It’s a real nice gun and I’m not going to sell it but for me it is heavy. I now more prefer lighter weight handguns. The first long gun I bought was a 12 gauge shotgun which I have since sold and replaced with a 20 gauge because my aging shoulder didn’t like the kickback. I didn’t see myself using the 12 gauge anymore. My suggestion is to try what your Dad, friends and neighbors have so as to better see what you like, and let that be your starting point. Just don’t lose sight of what purpose you intend for the gun to serve.

    #22817
    Profile photo of matt76
    matt76
    Survivalist
    member8

    Welcome Ogre. They are right, there is no perfect gun. I would take the time and go to a couple of stores near where you live that sell ammo and see what is on the shelf. Supplies are starting to build back up but some calibers are still lacking or all they have in stock is the high dollar bullets for a particular caliber. The main intended use is a very important factor. If you plan to hunt mainly an AK might not be the best bet. If you are looking for something that will do a little bit of everything you might look at a shotgun. There are a wide variety of bullet types for it that can do many things. However you will not get a great deal of distance out of it. Just my 2 cents

    #22818
    Malgus
    Malgus
    Survivalist
    member8

    Ogre,

    Well, the hunting thing is easy enough, but the “gunfight” thing is disconcerting…

    To me, what that means is that you’re gonna need something that can take down a deer-sized critter for eats, but can take a high capacity magazine if needed. A high capacity mag isn’t required for a “gunfight”, but it helps. Lots of good work has been done with boltguns with 5 round internal magazines, lever guns with tube magazines, etc.. just saying it’s an advantage…

    What I mean about the type of country you live in… goes to range. Are you out west where there ain’t but 6 trees between you and Canada, or are you in heavily forested country? If range requirements are shorter, then you can get by with a rifle that is Minute-Of-Pie-Plate accurate, which offers more choices (since not all rifles are created equal).

    The 7.62 x 39 cartridge can be loosely thought of as a “pointy 30-30″… they’re roughly equivalent in ballistics and bullet weight. Which means if you wouldn’t shoot at it with a 30-30, then don’t shoot at it with a 7.62×39…

    If it were me, I would choose something reasonably short, light and fast and at least 30 caliber. A 30 caliber rifle can do everything a 5.56mm can, but the 5.56 can’t do everything a 30 can… downside is that 30 caliber ammo is heavier, bulkier and you can’t carry as much as the 5.56 ammo… ounces equals pounds. Upside is that you can outrange folks with smaller rifles and the 30’s generally have better barrier penetration and perform better against soft targets, depending on the type of bullet used, of course…

    Then there’s the almighty question… what’s your budget? You can buy something right now for cheap, and then save your pesos until you have enough to leverage a really good rifle or carbine. Or, if you have the coin, go for it right now… or you could buy something on the cheap and then bounce around, getting a feel for what you like best… some guys I know, they like lever guns in revolver calibers because they can use the same ammo for the rifle and their revolvers… some guys have carbines in pistol calibers – like 9mm and 45 ACP – for the same reason…

    And just cause it’s old, don’t mean it’s useless… plenty of creaky old cartridge/rifle combinations out there that still do good work.. and don’t forget that the bloodiest war in our history was fought with 19th century technology…

    Interested to hear what you’re favoring and your reply…

    The wicked flee when none pursueth..." - Proverbs 28:1

    #22820
    Selco
    Selco
    Survivalist
    member6

    Welcome here Ogre, looks like you covered lot of stuff on proper way.
    It is always cool to see someone young like you taking this stuff so serious, Malgus gave you some great suggestions about choices.

    #22845
    Profile photo of freedom
    freedom
    Survivalist
    rnews

    Welcome to the forum Ogre.

    #22910
    Profile photo of undeRGRönd
    undeRGRönd
    Survivalist
    member8

    Hi OGRE!!! Welcome to SHTF!

    I was going to start out like you are now, and keep it simple.

    1. AR in 5.56
    2. 9mm Handgun
    3. 22LR small game rifle (10/22 originally)
    4. 12 Gauge Mossberg

    I got #1, 2, and 4, but picked up a Marlin 795 instead of the Ruger. Lots cheaper, plenty accurate and decent aftermarket support. I went with the AR since my son was USMC and had one as well. Mag and Ammo sharing. CHECK.

    Everything I was planning on buying was to compliment whatever my B.O.B. (Band of Brothers) had already, so as to maximize utility and usefulness.

    I ended up with lots more calibers due to the ammo shortage in 2013, as guns were more easy to come by than sufficient ammo counts in the quantities I was seeking…

    I still have the same calibers as my B.O.B. and a couple more. I have lots of rimfire stuff, but not just 22LR, I have a 17 HMR and a 22 Magnum also, which will round out the hunting requirements.

    So, in short, make a plan and STICK TO IT!!!
    Plan for one main battle rifle, one or 2 handgun calibers, plus a shotgun.
    Assess the rimfire availability in your area, and I do suggest one rimfire if you can get ammo.
    22LR will be the currency of the SHTF and after, but it is hard to get right now. This MAY be getting better, but not for sure yet. 22 Mag is very scarce too, but I see a good bit of 17 HMR around here. It is the easiest to shoot of the three, flattest and fastest. But strictly a small game round…

    A large caliber hunting rifle could do double duty as a battle gun and hunter, Malgus’s 30 cal recommendation is good, but I have a 270W (Savage model 110) that holds 5 rounds and has great range. It is a necked down 30-06 and shoots very flat. Similar velocity to an AR 5.56 round, at triple the bullet weight :D

    A 30-06 is a great rifle as well, and more varied ammo than the 270W, but I got a good deal on the 270 so I purchased it. Ammo is reasonable and available. Very similar to a 30-06 in price and performance, but has a better Ballistic Coefficient. The advantage to the 30-06 is the bigger bullet weights, if you need more OOMPH. Reloads, I imagine you could do a 30-06 that is a real performer, weight and speed. Easier to find reloading components, possibly.

    Just a few thoughts, and remember the K.I.S.S. Theory applies.
    I did not keep it simple :D

    "ROGUE ELECTRICIAN" Hoping to be around to re-energize the New World.....

    Cogito, ergo armatus sum

    #22916
    Profile photo of freedom
    freedom
    Survivalist
    rnews

    You are good undeRGRond. Just keep on adding when you find it at a good price. I have all except the AR 15 but I have a FAL L1A1 Sporter .308, still buying more .308 ammo. I hope I am able to buy an AR soon. I have two .22 LR rifles and two shotguns. Hand guns my 9mm, .380 and a .357.

    #22933
    Profile photo of Novus Ordo
    Novus Ordo
    Hunter
    rprepper

    Ogre – welcome aboard!

    Okay, you got some great advice from Malgus and others. I’m going to try and give you some added information on the SKS that you asked about.

    First the Cons – I have a Norinco SKS-D that I purchased years ago – that’s the one you’re interested in so I’m sure you know that unless you mod the magazine it’s a 10 rounder fixed in place. It’s also loaded from the top of the bolt with stripper clips which may be a bit slow if you have several targets. The sight radius (distance from rear sight to front sight) is like the AK, very short. This leads to a pretty large loss of accuracy because the rear sight is in front of the bolt and very far from your eye. You can buy rear receiver tops with new rear sights and/or scope mounts that will help with this. Lastly is ammo – you get what you pay for. The cheap Russian stuff will not be nearly as accurate as more quality made ammo.

    Pros – Most of the SKS’s are military grade and very reliable. Chrome line bores, and very forgiving when used in terrible environments. They will shoot and shoot and shoot – usually with minimal issues.

    I added a pic of a scoped one for you –

    Arms discourage and keep the invader and plunderer in awe, and preserve order in the world as well as property... mischief would ensue were the law-abiding deprived of the use of them.
    - Thomas Paine

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    #22935
    Profile photo of Novus Ordo
    Novus Ordo
    Hunter
    rprepper

    Hit submit a litte quick – so, Ogre, ultimately the decision is yours and what you like or how you will use it. The SKS is a reliable weapon, it’s cheap and most of the cons can be fixed or improved, but even out of the box it’s still got paper plate accuracy out to a hundred yards or so – maybe 200 if your shooting position is solid. Past that you’ll need to do some of the fixes above.

    Hope this helps in your decision making a bit. It’s great to see that you and your family have thought about these things and assigned jobs per family members and obviously you’ve taken yours seriously.

    Arms discourage and keep the invader and plunderer in awe, and preserve order in the world as well as property... mischief would ensue were the law-abiding deprived of the use of them.
    - Thomas Paine

    #22941
    Profile photo of Ogre206
    Ogre206
    Survivalist
    member2

    thank you for all the advice, based on your advice I decided to change my investment.
    I am planning to buy a vz58 , a gun that looks like the infamous AK-47 but make no mistake the only thing it has in common is the bullet it shoots.
    its cheaper than most SKSs I found online buy roughly 300-100$ one hell of a saving!
    now before yall tell me I should buy an AR-15, I agree but my dream gun and the one I can afford are two different things.
    later from there I’ll buy some more supplies along with some camo , I already have web-gear (Vietnam-era) I found while dumpster diving.
    later once I got all my pennies saved up I’ll buy a AR-15 then I’ll start reloading After that I’ll get an upper for .300 blackout. (and buy a new lower so I’ll have three firearms not just two and a half)
    to me its sound proof, but what do you guys think?

    #22944
    Profile photo of Novus Ordo
    Novus Ordo
    Hunter
    rprepper

    Ogre – take a look on http://www.gunbroker.com – they have SKS’s there for $200, but the lowest VZ58 I saw was $500. If you found one for less than and SKS, I’d say grab it!

    Arms discourage and keep the invader and plunderer in awe, and preserve order in the world as well as property... mischief would ensue were the law-abiding deprived of the use of them.
    - Thomas Paine

    #22984
    Whirlibird
    Whirlibird
    Survivalist
    member10

    Ogre, welcome.

    The VZ is a better gun than many give it credit for, typical Czech.
    The only real complaints are the price of magazines and the light barrel, for the high volume shooters.

    As to AR’s, buy your receivers (lower) now and build them as you can. PSA has sales regularly on cosmetic blemished lowers for $50 each.

    Once you have the initial firearm sorted out, I’d recommend working on 2 months good and water before another gun.

    Not knowing where you are, I won’t advise on a handgun. But I would start putting $10 a week back for one, by the time you’re legal to purchase one, you’ll have enough saved for a good one, a spare, ammo and some training.

    Food, water and meds aren’t romantic or exciting, but they are necessary. Having to do it over again, from your age I would focus on them heavily after the initial defense gun (s).

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