Viewing 15 posts - 61 through 75 (of 85 total)
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  • #12348
    Profile photo of jeepboy1991
    jeepboy1991
    Survivalist
    member1

    Yea  the M1/M2 carbine had real issues in Korea. The M2(full auto version) was always kind of “iffy” for its entire life. The Marines at  Chosin  said the carbine just wouldn’t work reliably in the extreme cold. Plus the heavy winter uniforms of the  enemy played havoc with penetration. But my reading indicates it was much better liked in  southeast asia. Plus the small stature of the people of Vietnam made it a easily handled weapon. I suspect that the fact that jungle fighting Is at pretty close range made the carbine more effective compared to some of the stuff in Korea.

    It seems that the M1 carbine is  either loved or hated depending upon the experience one had while carrying it. A lot of guys carried it a lot and shot it little and loved it but the guys who had to use it had mixed results.

    About the “thumb-buster”….. I have one that I use for cowboy action shooting, It won’t bite you  if you hold it right! (grin) And you are right, the .38 spl was originally  BP.

    #18040
    Profile photo of undeRGRönd
    undeRGRönd
    Survivalist
    member8

    New Stuff I just read about:

    22 TCM, 4o grain HP, uses a shortened 5.56 casing, gets ~2000 FPS from a pistol.
    Armscor/Rock Island Armory is the sole producer of weapons and ammo, for now, but it fits in a 1911 frame :D
    YouTube shows watermelons EXPLODING with just the kinetic energy release. Similar to a head???

    As for SHTF needs, I’m in a quandry. I have lots of ball ammo and mil surp, but I should find a good HP brand for certain occasions. I have 2 boxes each of SD ammo, in 9, 40 and 45 for carry before SHTF, but after?
    I am open for suggestions! I’d hate to have too much penetration if swarmed by un-armored zombehs…

    "ROGUE ELECTRICIAN" Hoping to be around to re-energize the New World.....

    Cogito, ergo armatus sum

    #18042
    Profile photo of undeRGRönd
    undeRGRönd
    Survivalist
    member8

    It’s basically like a Tokarev, if you will…

    "ROGUE ELECTRICIAN" Hoping to be around to re-energize the New World.....

    Cogito, ergo armatus sum

    #18089
    Whirlibird
    Whirlibird
    Survivalist
    member10

    UG,
    The .22 TCM is nothing more than another take on the old .22 Jet.

    Today we have the .22TCM, the 5.7×28, just modernizations of the old cartridge.

    The Jet had a few advantages, being chambered in a wheelgun, one could load it down if a less powerful round was needed or load with factory level power for defense or hunting.

    Even the late Col Cooper looked at it a survival tool but not as a primary weapon.

    We can argue handgun effectiveness, different handgun or rifle styles til everyone is blue in the face. The reality is that unless the bullet is put in the right place, and it damages or destroys something vital, we are just arguing how many angels can dance on the head of a pin.

    Are some handguns/rifles better than others? Much depends on your opinion and definition of better.

    Same goes for ammunition selection. Perhaps even more so.

    In most modern defensive loads, for handguns, the difference is negligible. A hit with a good 9mm defensive round is basically as effective as a good .45 or .40 defensive round. There is a reason the FBI is transitioning back to the 9mm, its easier to shoot than their .40’s and are just as effective, while not beating their guns into a premature grave.

    When we start talking about old school technology, military ball ammo for example, bigger is better and has proven so on battlefields from Mindanao to Iraq.

    But there’s a flip side to that coin, capacity.
    Many places, you aren’t working as part of a group or military squad. You are engaging in personal combat at the ATM, in the kitchen or on the street, facing multiple attackers and you’re alone.

    At that point, having a whole mess of bullets at your disposal is a good feeling.

    Been there, got the tshirt.

    So if handgun effectiveness is a toss up for caliber what could limit the effectiveness?

    Personal ability, can’t hit the broad side of a barn.
    Mental ability, the ability to take a life in actuality not just theory.

    Many people are lousy shots, it’s a fact.
    So if they can’t make telling hits, its not a bullet effectiveness issue but a skill issue. If you can’t put them where they need to go, regardless of what you are using, you are not being effective.

    And the mental issue. “Thou shall not kill”, long taught and preached but may not be correct, certain translations read the original as “Thou shall not murder”. With that small seemingly insignificant change, suddenly self defense killing becomes a null problem.

    I suspect that the mistranslation may have been intentional by some medieval lords and kings putting pressure on the church, to keep themselves and their underlings safe from peasants revolting.

    So with so much being a tossup, what is the answer?
    Is there an answer?

    You choose what fits your needs, budget and what’s available.
    Be it defense, hunting, concealment, you can narrow down your choices quickly with a little common sense, don’t get too hung up on the details, and learn how to use your choice to the best of your ability.

    Some places certain guns and ammo may be more available, or priced more attractively. I may prefer a certain style, make or caliber, but if its not available, is priced out of reason or you can’t get ammo for it, making it a fairly ineffective choice.

    We all have our personal favorites and choices, sometimes against all reason. I personally go back and forth on make, model and caliber on a regular basis.
    But my proven choices (to me) of make, model and caliber are still sitting here for me to finish my latest fling.
    Of the hundreds of guns I’ve owned, none were bad, some were just better than others filling my needs.

    Those effective in my hands remained when the others departed.
    Now, I’m finding new guns for my family that are effective for themm not just me.

    #18093
    Profile photo of freedom
    freedom
    Survivalist
    rnews

    Whirlibird, Great points. I find that at the range I hit the target more with my 9mm then my .357 or .380 so what you are saying is true. Go with gun you are most effective with.

    #18133
    Profile photo of undeRGRönd
    undeRGRönd
    Survivalist
    member8

    +1’s for Whirli and Freedom!

    The TCM looks like a winner, low recoil and excellent followup capability, but what about Ammo Availability???

    I think I will be fine with a regular autoloader handgun, (9, 40, 45) I have them all and like them all…
    My M&P9 is a full size, and it is really smoooth! Kinda large for summer CCW, but winter would be great!
    I’ll likely get a pocket gun 9mm and call it good. For SHTF I’ll likely use the bigger cal. and just OC or
    conceal tactically. I have some great long guns, no lack of power there :D

    "ROGUE ELECTRICIAN" Hoping to be around to re-energize the New World.....

    Cogito, ergo armatus sum

    #18138
    Robin
    Robin
    Survivalist
    member8

    UndeRGRond – I bought a High Point 45 acp carbine about two months ago. Came with a Red Dot style scope and tall front sight. Truly like it for the “inbetween” and got it because it shoots 45 acp with I have lots.
    Robin

    #18140
    Profile photo of undeRGRönd
    undeRGRönd
    Survivalist
    member8

    +1 Robin!

    I have all 3 caliber HP Carbines.
    Still need to check out (shoot!) the 40 and 45, but the 9 is great!
    CHEAP!!! Accurate! Fun! …and did I say CHEAP?
    Excellent Warranty! Fun to customize! Perfect for mid range CQB, or close up!
    Makes a 230g 45 ACP up to 150-200 fps faster, excellent stopping power!

    These things are really easy to clean and take apart, but my 995 was even easier to re-assemble! AMAZING!
    i DID NOT EVEN NEED THE VIDEO for putting it back together! Nice!
    I’m sure you will love it, Robin, but maybe get another firing pin now, before SHTF.
    That is the #1 wear item afaik

    I need to do that myself. Order Firing Pins!

    "ROGUE ELECTRICIAN" Hoping to be around to re-energize the New World.....

    Cogito, ergo armatus sum

    #18288
    Profile photo of Mark
    Mark
    Survivalist
    member1

    I thought the article will be about SP of armors :)

    Anyways, it was a good read. I would highly recommend to everyone reading this:

    http://www.theppsc.org/Staff_Views/Aveni/OIS.pdf

    Which gives statistical data from the USA related to gunfights between street thugs, officers and versus. Very interesting numbers are there! Pretty much strengthening Selco’s point (hit ratio is MINIMAL, especially in panic).

    And I would also recommend watching this:

    The guy here is not a commando/operator but a foot soldier, I understand that. But he was trained to fight, willingly in warzone, well fed, etc and still thanks to the level of panic (again: this TRAINED soldier!) having a hard time changing the magazine in his rifle.
    Also listen closely when he starts having hard time catching his breath because of being physically exhausted!
    Don’t forget, again, that he is a soldier in great physical condition, with military training and doing light labor in the gear he used to work with…

    #18372
    Whirlibird
    Whirlibird
    Survivalist
    member10

    You default to the level of your training.
    How many mag changes has he done under stress?

    Slow is smooth, smooth is fast.

    As part of the class I’ve been instructing, I’ve had the students do a mag change as fast as they can. Fumble city.

    Next I have them run a couple hundred yards and do the same mag change but as slow as they can do it smoothly.
    Well under half the time and no fumbling and dropping.

    And this is with AR’s as well as pistols.

    Sorry if the metaphor offends, but this isn’t the backseat of dad’s Buick, slow down and do it right. Less accidents.

    I haven’t ever heard of anyone winning a gunfight with a fast reload. But I have heard of a mess who lost them because they couldn’t settle down and make it work.

    #18381
    Profile photo of Mark
    Mark
    Survivalist
    member1

    Thank you for your reply. You have great points and I absolutelty agree with you on every level, however I might have been somewhat misunderstood.
    Just to “clean this up”: I didn’t mean mag change speed is key to anything, like, to win a fight (except it’s some special “mag change challenge” :)).

    What I meant is, and this is what people who have read the post should see and understand (and best seen on mag change & heard on breathing in the vid), is what does combat stress do to someone, even a trained person.

    Everyone must expect having shaky hands, heavy breathing, confusion and without training, a high chance to lose control and either panic, get dazzled or do what Selco’s friend did: start shooting frenzied (but hit nothing).

    #18383
    Whirlibird
    Whirlibird
    Survivalist
    member10

    Shaky hands, heart rate and blood pressure through the roof, ho chi mihn flip flops dancing on your feet, the inability to articulate normally, it all happens.

    If you train to a certain level and stop, that’s as good as you’ll ever be, and that’s without being stressed. But when something bad happens, your best day in combat is remarkably similar to your worst day training.

    Accuracy, motor skills, the ability to not sound like you just took a breath of helium, all gone in a split second.

    #18524
    Profile photo of undeRGRönd
    undeRGRönd
    Survivalist
    member8

    I’d imagine paintballing would be a fair approximation
    to combat, w/o the potentially lethal hits…

    "ROGUE ELECTRICIAN" Hoping to be around to re-energize the New World.....

    Cogito, ergo armatus sum

    #18535
    Whirlibird
    Whirlibird
    Survivalist
    member10

    <div class=”d4p-bbp-quote-title”>undeRGRönd wrote:</div>I’d imagine paintballing would be a fair approximation<br>
    to combat, w/o the potentially lethal hits…

    In my experience it can be detrimental.

    There’s a difference when the risks you take only put you out of this round of the game.

    You take unnecessary and dangerous risks.

    #18536
    Profile photo of namelus
    namelus
    Survivalist
    member7

    yeah notice he is completely crap trained, along with his squad. first reload mag is not empty . second no clear id from team of fire positions and disposition of enemy. no heavy cover suppressing when moving. way way too long moving without cover and yes he has cover but no concealment. they are not talking at all

    to further make it worse no use of smoke to move to a vantage point. they guys are heading to a meat grinder due to lack of training period.

    quick mag change does save lives but knowing when to switch weapons more so hesitation kills you so does stupidity.

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