December 2, 2017 at 5:39 am #54489
“[H]alf of the millennials it surveyed would rather live in a socialist or communist country than a capitalist society. And 22% of those surveyed had favorable views of Karl Marx… while 13% viewed Joseph Stalin and Kim Jong-un as ‘heroes.’ “
That study was conducted in the United States, among our future business and political leaders. Hope? I’m like Doug Casey – I ain’t got none.
Here’s the full article just published today. As usual, I generally have great appreciation for Doug Casey, but strongly recommend against clicking on a single one of the other items on this web page. Doug Casey no longer owns a controlling interest in the publication (or company) bearing his name – he sold that a few years ago, much to my dismay, and the company is now controlled by a man considered by many to be a common con-man, who makes a fortune out of his alleged con-jobs in the financial publication business. They trot out Doug Casey from time to time probably just to keep his long time subscribers to his paid newsletters from abandoning the organization that is otherwise fast going down the tubes. But enough of that. Just beware of all the bells and whistles attached to any article from Doug Casey. You can safely pay attention to this article, however:December 2, 2017 at 1:33 pm #54526
Well I am happy to report that I have two millennial’s that are not in that group. They believe 100% in the Constitution , in the freedom of speech, liberties that we all love. I am always talking to them so they understand because the Universities are full of Socialist. My millennial’s and there friends which I also talk to when they come to my house are all into the constitution.So please let all of them know.December 2, 2017 at 3:10 pm #54530
They advocate it , because they have never lived under it . Millenials are proof that birth control should be put into the drinking water nation wide .December 2, 2017 at 3:35 pm #54531
It is also how the parents grow them up in the home. I have two and they are always hearing every word I say. Sometimes they will call me on some but then time goes by and I show them that I was right and they will see the light.December 2, 2017 at 5:03 pm #54535
I firmly believe that a major contributing factor is age/experience. Anyone younger than probably 55 or more likely even 60, was not bombarded with the word “propaganda” on a routine basis back in the 50s and 60s. “Soviet propaganda,” “communist propaganda” – those were simply a normal part of life whether watching the evening news, or even listening to grown-ups in conversation for many of us back then. We didn’t really understand what “propaganda” meant exactly, but we knew that it was something bad by bad people, and that it was lies.
The left learned well from Alinsky’s 1971 masterpiece (Rules for Radicals). And it was a masterpiece, if you define “masterpiece” as highly effective and widely spread – even if the consequences were devastating to society. The term “propaganda” was turned back on those pointing it out, and suddenly we were hearing about “right wing propaganda” among other varieties. After a while, the term became wearisome because it was applied to “everything,” by somebody or other. And like anything that becomes wearisome, it falls out of use and becomes functionally meaningless.
I was fortunate to learn first hand what Soviet propaganda was by the very early 60s, when I inherited my grandfather’s old wood case shortwave radio, and discovered that world. Along the way, I discovered the English language service of Radio Moscow. What an eye-opening experience for a budding teenager, especially when political conversations simply didn’t happen in my family when I was growing up.
So today, the concept of propaganda is simply not something most people have ever even contemplated. Instead we get the soundbyte term “fake news” to the point that we’re beginning to gag on it. Fake news is simply lying news. Propaganda is an art form, because it’s not simple and easy to point out the embedded lies, if it’s well done propaganda. So the problem is that almost nobody recognizes propaganda anymore, and therefore almost nobody appreciates just how powerful it is, let alone the devastating effects it’s had on our own society. 50% of millenials “would rather live in a socialist or communist country than a capitalist society. And 22% of those surveyed had favorable views of Karl Marx… while 13% viewed Joseph Stalin and Kim Jong-un as ‘heroes’?!?“
Mighty effective! I doubt that even 1 in 1000 millenials could give even a C-minus definition of capitalism, but they all know it’s “bad.” Yes…mighty effective. Spread that effectiveness across far more than just economic system – morals, religion, social interaction, you name it – it’s been mighty effective. Freedom’s post is most instructive: his family LIVED under communism, escaped, and experienced the differences first hand. Yet just a generation or two later, even those close to him find him difficult to believe at first. Without experience and education in the home (as Freedom has done well), it can all be lost even in a generation.December 2, 2017 at 9:15 pm #54536
GS, “Freedom’s post is most instructive: his family LIVED under communism, escaped, and experienced the differences first hand.YES!! Yet just a generation or two later, even those close to him find him difficult to believe at first. Without experience and education in the home (as Freedom has done well), it can all be lost even in a generation.
It is true! My kids will have a hard time with there kids, it will be more difficult for them. The Socialist(really Communist) know this. They work under the long term system. In time they will all forget the past and lets get the history taken out of the schools so it can be done fasted. This is already happening. We have set them back with Trump but they believe it is temporary setback.December 3, 2017 at 1:49 am #54568
The focus of the replies here has been on communism. The survey was socialism or communism. That speaks to a poorly done survey. A preference for socialism should have been a separate question from a preference for communism. The other thing is most young people are going to think Canada or Western Europe when you say socialism which makes their replies a bit less onerous.
It is safe to assume that the responses favored socialism, European-style, not communism. We should take that as a sign that they are not seeing the current economy and social order as working for them. The alternative might work even less well for them, but they don’t know that. This has implications for all of us at the voting booth and elsewise.December 3, 2017 at 5:55 am #54601
Its not working for them , because they dont want to have to work …………thats what a socialist is .December 3, 2017 at 12:33 pm #54603
Tolik, my point is that they vote, and their feelings on the subject does have implications for all of us.December 3, 2017 at 3:57 pm #54604
Good thing the electorate actually did their job this time around .December 3, 2017 at 4:14 pm #54605
MountainBiker is right. They vote. This happen in Cuba, they were promised free everything and less work so they went out and voted over and over. Now there vote do not count. Socialism/Communism will use anyway to take power. There best way is to lie to the people.December 4, 2017 at 2:32 am #54611
When organizations like CPUSA and RevCom exist and are clearly well funded, it’s hard not to recall that Marx and Engels discussed both socialism and communism together, and explored the various outward forms. They did not make a distinction, in large measure, between the two, other than the fact that they were on a continuum, with full blown communism as the ultimate objective. Reading chapters 2 and 3 of the Manifesto can be rather chilling when thinking about modern society – one could easily forget that it was published 169 years ago, despite the fact that the Engels-approved English translation was done in 1888, if I remember correctly. It’s truly amazing how “modern” parts of it are! In many places the language often sounds like it was lifted out of a nightly “news” broadcast of today. The two are not separate – socialism is merely the transition, if done “right” according to Marx and Engels. And there are those working very, very competently to keep the progression moving. But few understand it, and therefore even fewer “see” it. Ignorance can be (short lived) bliss, but it also constitutes one’s head in the sand while the steam roller continues its relentless journey.
One needs only to study the sub-groups within the Democrat Party to understand just how effectively Marx and Engels understood their concept, as well as society in general. Probably few remember the direct connection between prominent Congress-critters (all democrats) and the Democratic Socialist of America. One could go to their web site and actually see the list of congressmen/women who were members of that organization before someone decided they’d better take the list and direct association down and semi-hide it. Marx’s and Engels’ uncanny ability to project the plan into the 21st century is remarkable (understatement!). One can only “choose” between socialism OR communism in ignorance. It’s kind of like choosing between the rain which falls during a temperature inversion that leads to an ice storm, and the result of the ice storm itself. The rain only gives the initial illusion of safety.December 4, 2017 at 4:27 am #54612
Gentlemen (and occasionally ladies),
We can discuss and debate the root cause, the history and deviation until the snow flies in Florida (it did here today), but it doesn’t address the problem.
We need a fix to this excrement.December 4, 2017 at 4:56 am #54613
Just happened to be up and getting ready to shut down the computer for the night and the above came in. My response isn’t likely to be appreciated. I simply don’t have a politically correct (or legal) answer. Oh, I’ve GOT an answer, but then I loop back to the previous sentence.
In theory, IF there is a workable answer, it does lie in really understanding the doctrines behind the problem, to an extent that allows us to explain it to younger folks (i.e. under about 55 -60) so they can begin to understand it for themselves. And for those here that fit in the 45-55 or 60 age range (and below) and feel shut out by that comment, my sincere apology. I do understand. But I also understand that there are some things that simply cannot be fully understood without having lived through them in real time, and studied them in detail. Only so much can be learned out of a book. One can read and appreciate Dr. Thomas Sowell all they want, but they still won’t have a full appreciation like he does for his subject. At age 87, and having fully embraced (but abandoned) Marxism in his very early adulthood, he’s got something almost none of us has – an understanding that includes first hand wisdom.
So, IF there’s a solution (and I believe we’ve progressed too far, sadly, for the temporal solution), it lies in educating people, often one-by-one. Freedom totally gets this concept, based on his comments about only being able to provide that education to his own children and perhaps grand children. He said:
It is true! My kids will have a hard time with the[ir] kids, it will be more difficult for them. The Socialist(really Communist) know this. They work under the long term system. In time they will all forget the past and lets get the history taken out of the schools so it can be done faste[r]. This is already happening.
Freedom and his family have “been there, done that.” Education is the key. In religion, they’d call it proselyting – actively reaching out to people, uninvited – and not many people are up to that (thus another reason I’m not optimistic).
The other solution – which I AM NOT advocating (even if my id loves the concept) – is contained in Mike Vanderboegh’s “The Six Apostles.” Fortunately, my ego and super-ego successfully override my id in that area. Totally ‘nuf sed on THAT!
(I believe there will be a total solution. But that’s a discussion for a totally separate topic within the Forum, and one I’m not personally going to initiate because there are too many divergent opinions on it, and it’s not an area I’m comfortable arguing about. That doesn’t mean I’m uncomfortable discussing it with people open to it, but arguing is altogether different. I’m highly familiar with the scriptural description of the origin, structure, methods, and solution to the problem. It’s more detailed than almost anybody would imagine. It just ain’t gonna come from me, here.)December 4, 2017 at 11:37 am #54628
GS, is right on. Education in the house, education in the schools, and education between friends and family.
Are we to fare in? Maybe but Trump did get elected so maybe we have some time to turn this ship around. Trump is changing the government and the socialist are fighting him in every way. But he can not education in the house, education in the schools, and education between friends and family that is our job. He also can not stop the schools and universities socialist, we have to do this. That is were are real fight is! lets protest the educators!
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